Interview with Karemi Rodríguez: when perfectionism generates discomfort

Psychologist Karemi Rodríguez Batista gives her perspective on the problems of perfectionism.

In the society in which we live, it is common to see how perfection is constantly extolled in all its forms.

The Western world is competitive and globalized, so we are subjected to a constant bombardment of news, images and videos showing extreme cases of people who stand out positively in something: the most skilled athletes, the artists with the greatest capacity to be groundbreaking, the most successful entrepreneurs, the most charismatic influencers.... And of course, the most attractive and young celebrities.

Perhaps that is why, in our culture, the fact of being content to live a good life without standing out in anything is something that is often looked down upon: people talk about mediocrity, conformism... For a large part of the population, paradoxically enough, the normal thing seems to be to try not to be part of normality, to strive for perfection. For this reason, on this occasion we will talk to psychologist Karemi Rodríguez Batista about the problems linked to perfectionism..

Interview with Karemi Rodríguez Batista: when perfectionism is a problem

Karemi Rodríguez Batista is a General Health Psychologist specialized in contextual therapies; she is also the creator of the website PsicoK, where she has been spreading information on topics related to psychology and mental health for years. She currently offers face-to-face therapy in her office in Madrid, as well as online therapy. In this interview we will talk with her about the problems that often arise from a poor management of perfectionism.

From your experience as a psychologist, what are the areas of life in which you have noticed that people in therapy tend to be overly perfectionistic?

First of all, I would like to clarify that there are types and levels. On the one hand, a healthy or more effective perfectionism would guide our behavior to do the best we can in a committed way, taking error as a learning opportunity and in a compassionate way.

On the other side is unhealthy or ineffective perfectionism, which occurs when achievements are seen as the thermometer of our worth as people and therefore with a panic to any error or form of disapproval, as well as excessive self-criticism, demand and need for control not only towards ourselves but also towards others, which leads us to rigid avoidant and compulsive behavior patterns, with a permanent feeling of not being enough.

In reality this phenomenon can touch any area. In my experience I have seen them in all areas: personal, relational, academic, work, family, and even health. This depends a lot on the person's learning history.

Considering that many times anxiety appears as a reaction to the fear of failure? can this be considered a form of problematic perfectionism?

Indeed, this is a fundamental characteristic that I mentioned, and not so much the anxiety or fear but what we do with it.

If, for example, we react by excessively checking something, seeking constant reassurance, procrastinating and/or avoiding situations or people important to us because of that fear, what we do is that in the short term we "reassure" ourselves, we avoid the probable unfavorable evaluation of the other person, but in the medium and long term we are feeding it more, and the dysfunctional anxiety will tend to increase both in its frequency and in its intensity and duration, as well as to generalize to other situations. And above all, in this process we will be taking away opportunities and values that are important to us.

Do you think that the tendency to fantasize about perfection can become an undesirable habit? Perhaps the people who obtain better and more outstanding results are those who at each step focus on concrete and achievable short-term goals, in order to progress slowly but surely.

Totally. Let's see, fantasizing in itself is even natural, but if we do it excessively, and using it as a strategy to control or manage our discomfort and in a very recurrent way, then we have to be alert because it can become a problem and we disconnect ourselves from more valuable and effective behaviors, as you rightly say.

In my opinion and experience, the best results are achieved in this way, having a direction, goals well grounded in values and an "action plan". There is a good technique that has to do with what you tell me, the SMART (for its acronym in English) that translated would guideline that our objectives were established being very specific, measurable, achievable, relevant and time bound.

Now, a relevant issue regarding goals from perfectionism, fed by our society, is this "he who wants, can" and "if you try hard enough, you get it" and it is a big lie, and a great source of suffering. Let's see, no, it's not that simple.

We are in a world interacting with people and contingencies that are generally not controllable by us; for this reason, it is better to be committed to our goals, but being aware that although many of them will be achieved, many others will not, or at least not as fast, and therefore it is crucial that our worth does not depend on this.

In cases where the level of perfectionism becomes excessive, with what kind of psychopathologies does it overlap?

Due to its characteristics it can overlap, and in some cases derive, in the so-called obsessive-compulsive personality disorder according to the DSM, or in the "ananchastic personality disorder" according to the ICD. It can also be a maintainer of other problems related to body image, anxiety, depression, eating disorders, etc.

What are the type of thoughts related to perfectionism that are often used as an excuse for procrastination?

Great question. There are several, of course, but the line would be those derived from an all-or-nothing (dichotomous) style, control and fear of failure. For example, "until..." is very common. "Until I have everything perfect, I don't send it" (and from here I check every last comma), "Until I have a doctorate, I don't attend", "Until I look perfect and feel confident enough, I won't talk to her (let's see with what criteria I am measuring this "perfect" and "confident enough" because I may never get there) and so on.

What can be done in psychotherapy to transform this desire to do things well into a source of potential and productivity, instead of something that gives way to bad habits?

First we nuance those criteria for "good," which come from our history and are very unique, as well as constantly changing.

Contextual behavioral therapies work very well at this. Very briefly, from a functional ideographic analysis of these problematic behaviors, it is proposed to enhance or implement others that in the long term will lead us to a much more valuable life, developing psychological flexibility and compassion (not indulgence) towards oneself and others, versus that rigidity and excessive criticism.

As the job market becomes increasingly competitive and demands specialization, do you think there may come a point where ideals of perfection through work are extolled that are unhealthy for most people?

Yes, sadly this is already the case, and we have to be careful. Our society has been developing since the end of the last century into a tremendously competitive and individualistic one and this, of course, is reflected in our behavior.

However, taking a bit of perspective, as some behaviors related to this are rigidity and procrastination, this translates into worse results in our work; from here creativity, satisfaction, teamwork, perseverance, or good coexistence are complicated. There is usually a lot of frustration, and interpersonal relationships are also affected.

Our life is directed more to avoid failure than to life satisfaction and to see mistakes or unpleasant experiences as learning opportunities. Someone said about perfectionism, I don't remember who: "We become successful failures", because whatever we do and wherever we are, it will never be enough".